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TailS_tff
Joined: 27 Feb 2008
Posts: 2
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 Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 18:07 Post subject: |
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Yes, I did ^^'
Diox will add the link to compare. |
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Dioxaz
Joined: 21 Feb 2008
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 18:21 Post subject: |
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Well, I finally had news from him. He confirmed that he used an MD1 to make his 2 OSTs (Sonic1+2 and Sonic3K).
Here is his recording of the competition screen theme:
http://dioxaz.free.fr/download/fm_synthesis/Son3K_2D_Options.mp3
As for others, it has been slitghtly mastered/compressed.
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TailS_tff
Joined: 27 Feb 2008
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 18:25 Post subject: |
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Well, concerning difference between md1 and md2, dac is more precise in md2 (end of nappe remain in md1, not in md2 version). Personally, I prefer md1, that sounds oldie.
(edit: Angel Island Zone Act 1 without that trailing sound is unthinkable lol)
(re-edit: and all my apologies Diox, I was wrong the first time^^') |
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TmEE
Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 238
Location: Estonia, Mahtra city
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| Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 16:09 Post subject: |
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Sine samples of MD1 and MD2...
http://www.epicgaming.us/tiido/MD_Sine.rar
Kindly done by Epicenter :
MD1 seems to have poor sines, and its so on all TL values. Also, when TL is 0, the wave is distorted a bit, and it gets better when the TL value is lower. DON'T use 00h TLs in TFM MM, you WILL have distorted sound on real HW !!!
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Shiru
Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Posts: 112
Location: Russia, Moscow
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| Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 17:19 Post subject: |
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| TmEE wrote: | | DON'T use 00h TLs in TFM MM, you WILL have distorted sound on real HW !!! |
Actually, TL's slightly less than zero still be too much, even in emulator. I added note about this into help of 1.21:
| Quote: | | Note: do not use too low (close to zero) values for TL of slots, it can cause to distortion of sound. Acceptable range of values is 5..25, depending from how much instruments sounds at once. |
Of course, this is true for any editor, not TFM MM only. |
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TmEE
Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 238
Location: Estonia, Mahtra city
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| Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 17:41 Post subject: |
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I've heard too many TFM songs that use too high TLs...
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Shiru
Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Posts: 112
Location: Russia, Moscow
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| Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 17:54 Post subject: |
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| I said that I added this note in v1.21, i.e. latest. So of course, earlier works doesn't take that into account. Other part of problem is that most of available ready-made instruments (from MVST, for example) uses TL=0. Anyway, it's not so big problem, because TLs can be corrected before exporting music - for now each instrument must be corrected manually, later I'll add function to correct all slot TL's at once. |
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madbrain
Joined: 13 Oct 2007
Posts: 102
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2008 16:46 Post subject: |
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| You could add a global volume function, just like in module formats like it/xm/s3m, which adds a value to the TLs of all the channels. Like, a global volume of 50% = add 8 to all TLs (since TLs are exponential, you don't need any multiplications). |
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TmEE
Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 238
Location: Estonia, Mahtra city
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| Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:06 Post subject: |
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That function is implemented in my sound engine for MD...
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zinger
Site Admin
Joined: 07 Aug 2007
Posts: 390
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 21:12 Post subject: |
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| TmEE wrote: | | zinger wrote: | | TmEE wrote: | | Stefan_L wrote: | | Stefan_L wrote: | | TmEE wrote: | | Stefan_L wrote: | | louisg wrote: | | TmEE wrote: | | Stefan_L wrote: | | zinger wrote: | | louisg wrote: | | What is the difference between Genesis models 1&2 and the Genesis 3 audio? The Gen3 sounded crisper to me-- higher bittage? Try listening to, say, the Rolling Thunder II intro when it fades out. |
Care to do a recording of all three versions, for comparison? |
I have two recordings showing the sound difference from my MD1 and MD2... the MD1 is recorded from headphone output and the MD2 from..well the only place it output sounds  (that is i have not modified the sound in any way).
http://arcade.ym2149.com/megadrive/
The MD2 recordings are from the version i have PCB pictures of on that page so it's version "315-5660" of the YM2612 emualtion and yes i call it "emulation" since it does not have any "real" YM2612, TmEE is of another opinion when i mailed him a while ago
I always suspected it's the "emulation" thats making the (my) MD2 sound worse than the my MD1 i made examples from, TmEE insists it's the soundcircuit and claim the "crystal clear audio mod" will solve it, but my tests wich was long while ago so i don't remember exactly was sounding bad even if i took the sound directly from the 315-5660 chip wich has the built in YM2612 and PSG... i will eventually do more tests and record them for proof when i have time (and are in the right mood).
The are updated 315-5660 in newer MD2's, TmEE has one. |
It is easier to put real thing into hardware than emulate it, and if my MD2 does have something emulated, it sure sounds better than Kega Fusion !!! And Crystal Clear Audio Mod is something I made as sound is something I really want to be perfect (heh, I even modded my Dreamcast for better sound !!!).
CCAM :
http://www.hot.ee/tmeeco/MDSNDMOD.JPG
how it looks like in my MD2 :
http://www.hot.ee/tmeeco/SNDMOD.JPG
and my MD2 in its glory :
http://www.hot.ee/tmeeco/MYSMD2.JPG
I have nowhere tho put any audio recordings, does anyone know any free host ? |
I'm thinking of the small redesign that Majesco put out here in the US. I guess it could be the sound circuit? But the 1&2 both sound fuzzier, almost like lower bittage.
Re: MD2 having emulated audio-- I don't see how that would be possible in ~1992 if you mean emulated via CPU. |
I ment hardware emulation (think bootleg)... like V-SID (FPGA): http://perso.orange.fr/silvertouch/VSID.htm
It does not nessecarily mean it would be "bad" but i did hear differences between my MD1 and MD2... as you see on TmEE pictures his MD2 has a "315-5660-02" so i presume it's is updated in some way compared to my MD2. Also that chip might be made by Yamaha, but i have no real info regarding that.
I will try the Crystal clear audio mod on my MD2. |
Stefan_L, your MD2 has newer board VA1.8 while mine is VA1, and after watching the board scans, if you're going to do something I have, you'll have trouble adding CCAM to your MD2 - You can't use "one side to another" holes when mounting components... but you could pseudo surface mount them (scratch protection of, tin it, and solder component on it)...
When CCAM gets tested out on a MD1, there is a chance it gets into production (as a small add on module).
The "lower bit rate" like sounding audio is caused by the use of $h1TtY filters... these filter out too much higher frequencies and thus sound sucks... or the sound is just caused by a poor mixing circuit... |
TmEE sent me an recording from his "CCAM" modified MD2, i have put it on my webpage for comparison with the other recordings i have there:
http://arcade.ym2149.com/megadrive/ |
Heres a webpage wich compares md1, md2 and Nomad... it's not about the actual sounds but how noisy the output is:
http://www.protoman.com/genesisaudio/ |
One bit of advice : NEVER EVER USE AUDIO FROM MD1 HEADPHONE JACK !!! This is to worst place to get any audio !!! Best sound comes from the head amps input pins (which I don't remeber).
And the guy who did the tests should have taken his sound cards inputs noise test too, that adds up to the noise levels of MD outputs. |
TmEE, you should make a tutorial on how to get the best sound out of these systems. I've been using the headphone jack. Are you up for it? |
If someone provides me a REAL MD1, then yeah... my MD2 is not up for the task... I can do some things according to my pirate MD1 (which is 1:1 to original, but fried unfortunately)... in any case, you need a soldering iron, few transistors and resistors and some wire. Best place to get these are fried CRT monitors. |
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Ikuma
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 12
Location: Singapore
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| Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 18:40 Post subject: |
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man, i just opened up a MD2 (VA 1.8 ASIA)[PAL] to find no YM-2612 chip inside... 
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TmEE
Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 238
Location: Estonia, Mahtra city
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| Posted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 00:30 Post subject: |
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All MD2's besides VA2 do not have a discrete YM2612 chip in them. The FM chip is integrated into the 315-5487, 315-5600, 315-5660 or 513-5700 chip. The intergrated chip is superior to discrete one, with cleaner and crisper sound.
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Ikuma
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 12
Location: Singapore
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| Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2010 14:10 Post subject: |
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| TmEE wrote: | | All MD2's besides VA2 do not have a discrete YM2612 chip in them. The FM chip is integrated into the 315-5487, 315-5600, 315-5660 or 513-5700 chip. The intergrated chip is superior to discrete one, with cleaner and crisper sound. |
thanks for the info!
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